Jay Belanger wrote:
> Raymond Toy <toy.raymond at gmail.com> writes:
> ...
>
>>>> I also don't understand why the defaults for maxima should cater to the
>>>> least experienced and knowledgeable users.
>>>>
>
>
>>> Because they're the ones we want to start using Maxima, because
>>> they're the ones who are least able to change the defaults ...
>>>
>
>
>> Except that they're only a beginner once.
>>
>
> And it's while they're beginners that they need be sold on Maxima.
>
>
Why do they need to be sold on maxima? If it works for them, great. If
it doesn't, there are other alternatives.
>> Tell them how to change it,
>>
>
> The people who know how to change the defaults can already change
> them. The people who know how to change the defaults are the
> non-beginners.
>
>
I don't consider myself a beginner, but I don't know how to change lots
of defaults in maxima. So?
Maybe I am a beginner.
>> point out the numerous web pages that explain floating-point etc. Once
>> they're past that stage, the defaults may be annoying.
>>
>
> Maxima is customizable; whoever finds the defaults annoying can change
> them.
>
>
So? The question is what the default should be. I think maxima should
display everything as well as possible by default.
>>>> Maxima probably already does things they can't understand. We
>>>> aren't we clamoring to remove those things too? :-)
>>>>
> ...
>
>>> Such as?
>>>
> ...
>
>> I guess the smiley was not enough? I would think that if you can't
>> understand some points about floating-point, and can't understand
>> scientific notation (as someone else mentioned), then I would think most
>> of the symbolic stuff would be incomprehensible. (That's a generic
>> "you", not, you, Jay, in particular.)
>>
>
> Anyone ready to use a CAS should know scientific notation. I wouldn't
> expect someone to know, by default, that what they type into Maxima
> isn't what Maxima works with, which I think is what this discussion is
> about.
>
>
If they understand scientific notation, I hope they also understand
significant digits. With that level of knowledge, it's not so difficult
to understand round-off, even in a decimal floating point system.
I don't really understand your argument. There are lots of things that
they MUST know to work with maxima. Why is sin(pi) not 0? Oh, because
it's %pi, not pi. Why is ln(e) not 1? Or log(10) not 1?
Why is sqrt(-1) = %i? Maybe this is just surface syntax that they need
to know, but you can't get around the fact that maxima may not match
their expectations.
I think we will just have to agree to disagree.
Ray
>